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View Poll Results: Is it abuse?
Yes! 32 53.33%
No! 7 11.67%
If the kid likes it who cares! 14 23.33%
You shouldn't opinate on how others teach their kids! 7 11.67%
Voters: 60. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-28-11 at 12:08 PM   #43
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Quote:
Ano, to say this is not abuse because it is not as bad as other abuse is an interesting view. using that as a measure, if your neighbors dad kills him then your dad just beats you into a coma, then the one is not abuse? all of your examples are abusive
I didnt say that its not abuse because its not as bad abuse as the others
I said its not abuse period and neither of the others are either .....but that the pageant one was borderline for me
Do I have to come over there and slap your legs young lady .............or just come over there and teach you how to understand the Queen,s english?
Either works for me lol
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Old 11-28-11 at 12:20 PM   #44
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Quote: Originally Posted by SSRCharlieB View Post
Xanth... two things about your "link". 1...Wikipedia is not a valid reference. Anyone can write or erase and replace,alter, etc, anything that is there any time that they wish. You could have written that there yourself before you ridiculously tried to present it as fact. (Did you?) If you ever give Wikipedia as a reference again I will be merciless. 2... That has no bearing whatsoever on this as weight training prevents/cures this type of injury and is used as physical therapy and treatment for it. On the same page, please don't try to use anything so lame in a "discussion" with me again or I will show you no mercy.

Not meant as threats, I just believe in giving a man "fair warning".

Charlie

======================================

Just came across this mate. I have never posted a WIKI link and so I have no idea what you are talking about.

@ano Well yeah mate, you try an be constructive and someone comes along and rattles your cage. Bad timing I guess. Cheers mate

Last edited by Xanth1942; 11-28-11 at 12:27 PM.
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Old 11-28-11 at 12:21 PM   #45
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I thought you were "through with me? It can get confusing when you are talking with several people at the same time. Especially when your blood pressure is through the roof and you are on Percocet (as I am). That was an error. I would humbly apologize, as I have to others on occasion, but I am not feeling too humble towards you at the moment. The "F" word comes to mind.

That was for someone else. He gave this link as reference...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repetitive_strain_injury
I'm out of it guys, the thread has taken an ugly tone.

I apologize for my part in it and ask for your pardon.

Mandy, the "digs" were in fun, didn't you see my conversation with Shony?

I am sorry if you took offense, I meant you no harm.

Ano, sorry to you too. I thought I had found another worthy friend. Looks like I was wrong. I was having fun. I thought he was too.

Well, if things (my health) don't take a turn soon, I won't be around much longer anyway.

To those that have been my friends here, thank you.

To those that haven't, sorry, maybe in the next life.

To those who have chosen to be my enemy...

well, just insert the appropriate line here _____________________________.

Charlie.

Last edited by SSRCharlieB; 11-28-11 at 12:36 PM.
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Old 11-28-11 at 12:30 PM   #46
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No need to apologise..... especially to me charlie
Just seems you two are arguing the wording but your views are roughly the same so seems a shame to get all wound up when you,re both smart guys by the looks of it
Trying to lose the idiots in here me not the smart members lol
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Old 11-28-11 at 12:38 PM   #47
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Quote: Originally Posted by anomander View Post
No need to apologise..... especially to me charlie
Just seems you two are arguing the wording but your views are roughly the same so seems a shame to get all wound up when you,re both smart guys by the looks of it
Trying to lose the idiots in here me not the smart members lol
I'm not smart. Didn't you see Xanth's post?

I am a moron.

Oh, the pain!!!

Charlie
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Old 11-28-11 at 12:44 PM   #48
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@lvstealth:

Although you're right, from what I've seen on this video and pageant kids, pageant kids aren't as happy as you say. I've seen a show (actually not a whole show, but I catch pageant tv shows very now and then and see for them for about 1 min).

Even though they may be happy sometimes, I usually see her parents (ussualy their moms) saying stuff like "Dont cry, you're not a baby anymore" or "Dont you want to win?", the child replies "No, I dont like doing this, I wanna go home." and the mother replies back "Well, you'll get punished if you leave yada yada yada.

I never seen a child from pageants ever being happy, only stupid mothers forcing that on their childs, and even I remember this time where another said "I'm thirsty." and the mom replies "You'll only get water if you do the exercises right, so if I were you I would start doing them".

I would consider pageants abuse anytime anyday, because it's obvious that their mothers are projecting themselves into their kids, and not in a healthy way...if there's even a healthy way of doing it....

I dont know if everyone would pick on the kid though....I mean, of course kids are "evil", but not necessarly towards someone who works out or has a big build. There may be cases, but I dont think they happen often.

And like Charlie said, he doesnt look like that when he's not working out..maybe he has that bodybuilder walk, but other than that I doubt that we can see him that pumped.

@Charlie:

Yes Charlie, everyone knows (at least I do) that you're passionate (for lack of a better word atm) about kids and their safeness. I also agree that he's very calm and confident, and eve if he started a bit forced, I doubt that he doesnt like it. I cant really say more cause I really dont disagree much with you.

About your saying that there are no downsides in pushing weights if done properly I agree, but I think that in this case 8 kilos is too much for him to handle now (video below), seing that he cant even mantain a good posture to lift the weights.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPMB6oTfc44
Quote: Originally Posted by SSRCharlieB View Post
I did some research with the idea of proving that this was bad for the child, and what I discovered was that I was wrong,
Oh, the irony! :p


@shonymat: Although child obesity isn't child abuse, I would consider that more of a concern that this child working out.

@ND: I actually voted ye, but Charlie made me think twice about my decision after he provided some links and some I found myself.

@Narubxan: For what I know RSI isn't common on people who do bodybuilding, but rather people who always do repetitive tasks as writing, typing, etc. There are some cases on gymnastics (which he does too) but never heard any case in bodybuilding.

@Xanth1942: You had a child at age 15? wow, that's young...
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Old 11-28-11 at 01:03 PM   #49
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@ Charlie

Well I pretty much type on the fly that's why my grammar sucks so much, however I did remove the name calling within moment's of posting as I must confess I immediately regretted it. I was not quick enough apparently, an so I apologise for my moment of weakness. It was immature and uncalled for. Unfortunate for you is you that chose to denigrate my expertise on this matter. Given my history I tend to respond like Marty McFly does when someone calls him chicken. Yes my people skills still suck at times. I am sorry to hear that you are reliant on medication for you blood pressure and I will certainly bear that in mind the next time you call me chicken :)

Last edited by Xanth1942; 11-28-11 at 01:05 PM. Reason: Surprise surprise! my grammar is just to die for
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Old 11-28-11 at 01:04 PM   #50
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@Charlie: I gave the link, although if you notice it was as an edit, outside of what i was saying already and wasnt meant as an argument towards it being abuse, was simply a side/afterthought about something else you had said earlier and I was a bit reckless since i didnt put it in context.

My work as a masseur I see far more muscular problems in people who go to gyms in general than in people who dont but work out by themselves and as such i assume (wrongly i guess) that the kid wasnt being properly guided, especially since what he is doing is more towards bodybuilding.

I do however apologize if I offended you in any way, i love to argument and many times i dont even argue with my own perspective, but on a divergent one which usually drives people crazy, i try to argue on a point of view that isnt my own, i found its the best way to get educated about a subject, research only covers that much, peoples opinions and ideas are far more valuable to me, i learn better that way.

@everyone: Either way, this ends up being more towards each individual view of what is abuse and what it isnt, beyond a definition, so we wont reach any conclusion and as such just take it easy in general, no need to get flared up.
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Old 11-28-11 at 01:25 PM   #51
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Quote: Originally Posted by Method512 View Post

@Xanth1942: You had a child at age 15? wow, that's young...
Well yeah when I signed up I kinda, sorta 'shuffles feet and stares listlessly at the floor' lied about my age. Haven't got around to amending it assuming I can of course. In any case I didn't become a father till I was in almost 30.
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Old 11-28-11 at 01:26 PM   #52
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Okay Xanth1942, I can and do accept that apology.

I am willing to start over if you are, but on some conditions...

No matter how heated things may get in the future, do not cross the line with stuff like that. Remember that if I don't respect someone's ability/knowledge/manner, well, something about that person, or if I don't like someone, my posts are curt, rude and directly to the point. I don't get into long discussions with them.

I like a good "spirited discussion" about most anything, and in the midst of it, I may try to "push a button" to see how the other person may respond. I may argue a side that I do not agree with, just for the sake of a good debate. This is done tongue in cheek, with no intent to harm, so please bear that in mind. Also, and very important to the context/content of any conversation that you may have with me, I am not well. I have no idea if I will be alive for supper, or if I will live to be 80. It doesn't look good right now, but things do change. They have before.

Please bear in mind that I am on mecdication all of the time now. I am presently taking a triple dose of meds for my B.P. alone, yet earlier, when I checked my B.P., it was 156/92. Not good for anyone at any time but particularly so for me, as I have always been on the very low side of the norm. I am on Percoset and a couple of other medications for pain. All of this messes with my mind at times, and I occasionally make mistakes in perception or in my wording of things. I often go back and edit my posts again and again, especially about the little stuff. Please bear with me on this.

In the future, if I offend you, please just say so. I will apologize, and as I am fond of saying, I will not hold a grudge as long as you don't talk about my mother. Also, I know that I am full of $h!t. I am just trying to have a good time, for whatever time I have left.

These are my terms.

Are they acceptable Sir?

Charlie

Last edited by SSRCharlieB; 11-28-11 at 10:57 PM.
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Old 11-28-11 at 01:47 PM   #53
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Edit

Comments removed due to being pointless.

However I do apologise to the rest of the forum for allowing myself to be goaded into childlike behavior.

Last edited by Xanth1942; 12-22-11 at 05:22 AM.
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Old 11-28-11 at 01:58 PM   #54
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Get a ****ing room you two...
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Old 11-28-11 at 05:10 PM   #55
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Quote: Originally Posted by Xanth1942 View Post
Please don't call me sir Charlie. I work for a living. Well at least I used to :)

It's all good mate. Sometimes a child has to break a toy before they realise the value of it. As Ano pointed out it not much is achieved when you argue over what really amounts to semantics. I think some subject matters hit too close to home for some (me in this case) and rational thinking is the first casualty.
Does that mean that you accept my terms for a do-over?

That is a serious question. Well... sort of... Yeah, serious... I think...

Ah... Right... Absolutely serious...

Okay... sure...

Huh?

Yeah, that was a serious question.

---------------------------------------------------------------

Last edited by SSRCharlieB; 11-28-11 at 08:51 PM.
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Old 11-28-11 at 06:12 PM   #56
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Quote: Originally Posted by anomander View Post
I didnt say that its not abuse because its not as bad abuse as the others
I said its not abuse period and neither of the others are either .....but that the pageant one was borderline for me
Do I have to come over there and slap your legs young lady .............or just come over there and teach you how to understand the Queen,s english?
Either works for me lol
wow! would you? either sounds intriguing!

Quote: Originally Posted by SSRCharlieB View Post
Mandy, the "digs" were in fun, didn't you see my conversation with Shony?

I am sorry if you took offense, I meant you no harm.
ah Charlie! no offense taken, you asked somethings and you made some statements, i replied. you wanted me to, i even came home from work for a few minutes to do just that! All just for you! well, that and the fun of it. giggle.

i am still of the opinion that the extreme is abuse. after reading what you cited, and finding so many more, i am convinced it is also unhealthy. cite after cite says NO to body building. mild strength training for children over 6, but NO to anything younger. the kid is definitely body building (not an opinion, his daddy says so). he is not doing anything "moderate" which all the articles you cited emphasize (again, not surmise, his daddy says so!)

when i was a kid, we went to this place and did some free climbing. it was a 1000 ft drop and i had no ropes, no equipment, just a dad helping me out. i love my dad. i wanted to be up there. but it was abuse. just ask my mom! if... if i had fallen, i would be dead, no doubt. if i had had anything happen i may have developed some life altering phobia. if we had come upon any of the multitude of critters that inhabit the rocks... well who knows what might have happened. just because of luck, maybe even the skill of my father, nothing bad happened. but that does not reduce the fact that it was not a good thing for him to do. although i did find the most amazing thunder egg! it has tilt lines! but nonetheless, he risked my life. that is abuse. i live with very few grey lines, most things are black and white for me. i hold myself to the same standard i hold others to.

smiling,
Mandy
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