File sharing debate

NumNum · 06-25-12 at 06:45 AM

Hello

Im doing some research for my college and I want to know what you guys think about file sharing. Is it right or wrong? why you do it?

thank you in advance

**L1b3rta** · 06-25-12 at 06:49 AM

I assume you want to know about the 'piracy' part in filesharing, and not how convenient it is to be able to share non copyrighted material.

These two long discussed threads should help you out for your homework:
Piracy is NOT Theft: Problems of a Nonsense Metaphor

Illegal file sharing isn't 'stealing': Here's why

JuicySquirrel · 06-25-12 at 09:08 AM

File sharing is theft.
When you "share" something you reduce the amount of time or quantity of something you have (reduction of some sort), this means you give up a portion of something. When you digital copy or replicate something you give another person access to content so that they have it without any loss of quantity or content on your part, they then have something without providing a trade of sorts to the original producer of digital content.

You can't pay for one ticket in a movie theater and share 1 seat with another friend.

Let's say you personally make a video game, movie or something similar. Your neighbor buys a copy from you. He then goes around the neighborhood and uploads this to everyone computer, they then upload this to all their friends and families computers. Would you be alright with only selling very few copies of your product and everyone else giving it away for free? What if you had to make a living off of your work, what if your neighbor who bought one copy allowed everyone to come by and copy the content from his computer for a 20% entrance fee to enter his house, 20% of the total price he originally paid to you for getting the original copy. That is what file hosting sites are, I'm not going to beat around the bush and pretend it isn't illegal or wrong when it is. At least I'll admit that. File sharing is not sharing, it is stealing. It's falsely called "file-sharing," when it should really be called "file-duplication." AARrrrr.

Games are way over-priced though, they should be $20~not 50 or 60. I actually buy music I like from online sources, file posting sites like this and Avax has introduced me to content I would otherwise never of come across. Sometimes I buy games I really like, I never open them~I go online and download the cracked version to avoid advertisements and having to put my CD in everytime. I will never buy a game which uses DRM. NEVER.

I work in the video game industry as a game-artist, btw. The way in which content is delivered to consumers has rapidly changed, and the markets haven't kept up, this is why there is such an issue~though it has serious influences from current economic situations, people make less and the value of currency of spending power has diminished over 50%. Change the economic atmosphere and you will see piracy diminish, give people the freedom to store content and use it how they wish, and allow for various methods of delivering content.

**L1b3rta** · 06-25-12 at 10:13 AM

No, good sir. Illegal filesharing of copyrighted files isn't theft, its copyright infringement, there's a difference. And courts (such as the U.S. Supreme Court) agree.

Code: Select All

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?navby=search&court=US&case=/us/473/207.html

Quote:

(a) The language of 2314 does not "plainly and unmistakably" cover such conduct. The phonorecords in question were not "stolen, converted or taken by fraud" for purposes of 2314. The section's language clearly contemplates a physical identity between the items unlawfully obtained and those eventually transported, and hence some prior physical taking of the subject goods. Since the statutorily defined property rights of a copyright holder have a character distinct from the possessory interest of the owner of simple "goods, wares, [or] merchandise," interference with copyright does not easily equate with theft, conversion, or fraud. The infringer of a copyright does not assume physical control over the copyright nor wholly deprive its owner of its use. Infringement implicates a more complex set of property interests than does run-of-the-mill theft, conversion, or fraud. Pp. 214-218.

Am not implying that breach of copyright is lawfully legal (though morally correct if you wouldn't have bought the media in question anyway), but let's just stick with the law if we're throwing around law related convictions.

Edit:
But hey, I know how stubborn people can be when it comes to letting an outdated notion go that has been stuck for so long and from such a young age. I mean, Pluto is still considered a planet to a vast crowd.

**Shawn_7** · 06-25-12 at 11:44 AM

And you can still say you're a Kopimist of the First United Church of Kopimism and you must share files on religious ground. Not a joke, it exists and it's already officially recognized as a religion in Sweden.

No religious debate, of course, just a info

Code: Select All

http://kopimistsamfundet.us/

Valid_Username · 06-25-12 at 01:28 PM

Quote:

Hello

Im doing some research for my college and I want to know what you guys think about file sharing. Is it right or wrong? why you do it?

Awesome post dude!!

It's right -> because it's awesome.
I do it -> because it's awesome.

**JiffOrange** · 06-25-12 at 01:42 PM

I always buy the content which is worth (in my view) paying for. There is so much rubbish peddled out that it is difficult to make informed decisions, that is why I download. Some of the drivel I have paid for in the past should be called steeling.

Cheers,

Jiff

**MacFalic** · 06-25-12 at 02:53 PM

@Shawn_7
Thank you for the introduction to Kopimism! (copy-me-ism)
all hail ctrl+c ctrl+v

One must decide just what is copyright Piracy and what is file sharing.
Piracy is where one profits by reselling another's copyrighted material.
File sharing is defined by those that chose not to pay for less than impressive material be it from Hollywood, musicians, or game creators\vendors.

Stop blaming profit losses on file sharing. Provide a product that is worthy of being paid for!

**chinta** · 06-25-12 at 03:08 PM

heh.

I'm doing it becouse there is certain element of fun there.

Also I'm doing it, becouse I f*ck*** can!

Downside is:
1) it takes a LOT of time...
2) it takes to spend money to be able to do this.

I share only movies. And mostly non-mainstream, rare movies. Becouse I like watching them myself whenever I want in a way I like (not some kind of stupid local dubbed crap which might appear or not appear locally after 2 years).

And I hate TV. I dont watch it at all. There is Internet nowadays for that :D TV is something soo ancient...brrr. Seriously, I dont need it at all. 1 reason of course is ads. I cant stand them.

When I see term "illegal sharing" it makes me nearly mad and I just want to share more.
And I share a Lot. 50-100GB+ per day easily.

**L1b3rta** · 06-25-12 at 03:23 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by MacFalic

One must decide just what is copyright Piracy and what is file sharing.
Piracy is where one profits by reselling another's copyrighted material.

Piracy is the common mantle reference to unauthorized use or copying of copyright protected software, which doesn't include make proft by reselling of illegal copies in its definition. What does share such a definition (but is only part of the many definitions in the word) is bootlegging (thefreedictionary.com/bootlegging).

thefreedictionary.com/piracy:

Quote:

2. The unauthorized use or reproduction of copyrighted or patented material: software piracy.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement_of_software:

Quote:

The copyright infringement of software (often referred to as software piracy) refers to several practices which involve the unauthorized copying of computer software.

webopedia.com/TERM/S/software_piracy.html:

Quote:

software piracy

The unauthorized copying of software.

**MacFalic** · 06-25-12 at 04:56 PM

@L1b3rta
It seems you are caught up in semantics and the CSS, IFPI, SIAA, and the RIAA, to name just a few, definitions they wish to foist upon we the public.

Bootlegging is accurate. It refers to cowboys that used to hide illicit items in their tall boots. I wonder(not really) how that can be applied to an act of Piracy?
Technically so is Piracy. To acquire property from "source" (generic) and offer same at some price to others. So lets not get into a pissing contest regarding whom can more efficiently use the language, hmmmm?

**Gandolph13** · 06-25-12 at 05:15 PM

So out forum name is going to end up in more uni research???????????????????????????????????

Go find somewhere else....................

**Shawn_7** · 06-25-12 at 06:52 PM

Quote:

Go find somewhere else....................

Agree. Or at least anonymize the data.

@MacFalic: You are welcome among the Kopimists :)

@Liberta: Wikipedia, piracy: "Piracy is an act of robbery or criminal violence at sea".

Anybody here is at sea on a pirate ship? What a romantic idea, to board Spanish ships and kidnap the ladies, take them to the Tortuga and then one of them falls in love with the pirate commander - who, of course, it's me.

Very Romantic, skipper

**Pauz** · 06-25-12 at 08:24 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Shawn_7

And you can still say you're a Kopimist of the First United Church of Kopimism and you must share files on religious ground. Not a joke, it exists and it's already officially recognized as a religion in Sweden.

No religious debate, of course, just a info

Code: Select All

http://kopimistsamfundet.us/

Wow that is wonderful

06-25-12 at 09:08 AM	#3
JuicySquirrel Newcomer Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 75	File sharing is theft. When you "share" something you reduce the amount of time or quantity of something you have (reduction of some sort), this means you give up a portion of something. When you digital copy or replicate something you give another person access to content so that they have it without any loss of quantity or content on your part, they then have something without providing a trade of sorts to the original producer of digital content. You can't pay for one ticket in a movie theater and share 1 seat with another friend. Let's say you personally make a video game, movie or something similar. Your neighbor buys a copy from you. He then goes around the neighborhood and uploads this to everyone computer, they then upload this to all their friends and families computers. Would you be alright with only selling very few copies of your product and everyone else giving it away for free? What if you had to make a living off of your work, what if your neighbor who bought one copy allowed everyone to come by and copy the content from his computer for a 20% entrance fee to enter his house, 20% of the total price he originally paid to you for getting the original copy. That is what file hosting sites are, I'm not going to beat around the bush and pretend it isn't illegal or wrong when it is. At least I'll admit that. File sharing is not sharing, it is stealing. It's falsely called "file-sharing," when it should really be called "file-duplication." AARrrrr. Games are way over-priced though, they should be $20~not 50 or 60. I actually buy music I like from online sources, file posting sites like this and Avax has introduced me to content I would otherwise never of come across. Sometimes I buy games I really like, I never open them~I go online and download the cracked version to avoid advertisements and having to put my CD in everytime. I will never buy a game which uses DRM. NEVER. I work in the video game industry as a game-artist, btw. The way in which content is delivered to consumers has rapidly changed, and the markets haven't kept up, this is why there is such an issue~though it has serious influences from current economic situations, people make less and the value of currency of spending power has diminished over 50%. Change the economic atmosphere and you will see piracy diminish, give people the freedom to store content and use it how they wish, and allow for various methods of delivering content. Last edited by JuicySquirrel; 06-25-12 at 09:16 AM.

06-25-12 at 10:13 AM	#4
L1b3rta Guru Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,987	No, good sir. Illegal filesharing of copyrighted files isn't theft, its copyright infringement, there's a difference. And courts (such as the U.S. Supreme Court) agree. Code: Select All http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?navby=search&court=US&case=/us/473/207.html Quote: (a) The language of 2314 does not "plainly and unmistakably" cover such conduct. The phonorecords in question were not "stolen, converted or taken by fraud" for purposes of 2314. The section's language clearly contemplates a physical identity between the items unlawfully obtained and those eventually transported, and hence some prior physical taking of the subject goods. Since the statutorily defined property rights of a copyright holder have a character distinct from the possessory interest of the owner of simple "goods, wares, [or] merchandise," interference with copyright does not easily equate with theft, conversion, or fraud. The infringer of a copyright does not assume physical control over the copyright nor wholly deprive its owner of its use. Infringement implicates a more complex set of property interests than does run-of-the-mill theft, conversion, or fraud. Pp. 214-218. Am not implying that breach of copyright is lawfully legal (though morally correct if you wouldn't have bought the media in question anyway), but let's just stick with the law if we're throwing around law related convictions. Edit: But hey, I know how stubborn people can be when it comes to letting an outdated notion go that has been stuck for so long and from such a young age. I mean, Pluto is still considered a planet to a vast crowd. Last edited by L1b3rta; 06-25-12 at 10:43 AM.

06-25-12 at 11:44 AM	#5
Shawn_7 Elder Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Eventyrland Posts: 3,516	And you can still say you're a Kopimist of the First United Church of Kopimism and you must share files on religious ground. Not a joke, it exists and it's already officially recognized as a religion in Sweden. No religious debate, of course, just a info Code: Select All http://kopimistsamfundet.us/

06-25-12 at 02:53 PM	#8
MacFalic Sleeps with Kuune Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Land of Cunning Sheep Posts: 838	@Shawn_7 Thank you for the introduction to Kopimism! (copy-me-ism) all hail ctrl+c ctrl+v One must decide just what is copyright Piracy and what is file sharing. Piracy is where one profits by reselling another's copyrighted material. File sharing is defined by those that chose not to pay for less than impressive material be it from Hollywood, musicians, or game creators\vendors. Stop blaming profit losses on file sharing. Provide a product that is worthy of being paid for! Last edited by MacFalic; 06-25-12 at 02:58 PM.

06-25-12 at 06:52 PM	#13
Shawn_7 Elder Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Eventyrland Posts: 3,516	Quote: Go find somewhere else.................... Agree. Or at least anonymize the data. @MacFalic: You are welcome among the Kopimists :) @Liberta: Wikipedia, piracy: "Piracy is an act of robbery or criminal violence at sea". Anybody here is at sea on a pirate ship? What a romantic idea, to board Spanish ships and kidnap the ladies, take them to the Tortuga and then one of them falls in love with the pirate commander - who, of course, it's me. Very Romantic, skipper Last edited by Shawn_7; 06-25-12 at 06:58 PM.

06-25-12 at 06:49 AM	#2
L1b3rta Guru Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,987	I assume you want to know about the 'piracy' part in filesharing, and not how convenient it is to be able to share non copyrighted material. These two long discussed threads should help you out for your homework: Piracy is NOT Theft: Problems of a Nonsense Metaphor Illegal file sharing isn't 'stealing': Here's why

06-25-12 at 01:28 PM	#6
Valid_Username Expert Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: UK Posts: 720	Quote: Hello Im doing some research for my college and I want to know what you guys think about file sharing. Is it right or wrong? why you do it? Awesome post dude!! It's right -> because it's awesome. I do it -> because it's awesome.

06-25-12 at 01:42 PM	#7
JiffOrange Elder Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: $_POST['WIN!']; Posts: 2,665	I always buy the content which is worth (in my view) paying for. There is so much rubbish peddled out that it is difficult to make informed decisions, that is why I download. Some of the drivel I have paid for in the past should be called steeling. Cheers, Jiff

06-25-12 at 03:08 PM	#9
chinta Epic Pirate Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 4,283	heh. I'm doing it becouse there is certain element of fun there. Also I'm doing it, becouse I fck** can! Downside is: 1) it takes a LOT of time... 2) it takes to spend money to be able to do this. I share only movies. And mostly non-mainstream, rare movies. Becouse I like watching them myself whenever I want in a way I like (not some kind of stupid local dubbed crap which might appear or not appear locally after 2 years). And I hate TV. I dont watch it at all. There is Internet nowadays for that :D TV is something soo ancient...brrr. Seriously, I dont need it at all. 1 reason of course is ads. I cant stand them. When I see term "illegal sharing" it makes me nearly mad and I just want to share more. And I share a Lot. 50-100GB+ per day easily.

06-25-12 at 03:23 PM	#10
L1b3rta Guru Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,987	Quote: Originally Posted by MacFalic One must decide just what is copyright Piracy and what is file sharing. Piracy is where one profits by reselling another's copyrighted material. Piracy is the common mantle reference to unauthorized use or copying of copyright protected software, which doesn't include make proft by reselling of illegal copies in its definition. What does share such a definition (but is only part of the many definitions in the word) is bootlegging (thefreedictionary.com/bootlegging). thefreedictionary.com/piracy: Quote: 2. The unauthorized use or reproduction of copyrighted or patented material: software piracy. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement_of_software: Quote: The copyright infringement of software (often referred to as software piracy) refers to several practices which involve the unauthorized copying of computer software. webopedia.com/TERM/S/software_piracy.html: Quote: software piracy The unauthorized copying of software.

06-25-12 at 04:56 PM	#11
MacFalic Sleeps with Kuune Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Land of Cunning Sheep Posts: 838	@L1b3rta It seems you are caught up in semantics and the CSS, IFPI, SIAA, and the RIAA, to name just a few, definitions they wish to foist upon we the public. Bootlegging is accurate. It refers to cowboys that used to hide illicit items in their tall boots. I wonder(not really) how that can be applied to an act of Piracy? Technically so is Piracy. To acquire property from "source" (generic) and offer same at some price to others. So lets not get into a pissing contest regarding whom can more efficiently use the language, hmmmm?

06-25-12 at 05:15 PM	#12
Gandolph13 Legendary Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Australia (GMT+10) Posts: 12,315	So out forum name is going to end up in more uni research??????????????????????????????????? Go find somewhere else....................

06-25-12 at 08:24 PM	#14
Pauz Not A People Person Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: United Police State of America, CA Posts: 487	Quote: Originally Posted by Shawn_7 And you can still say you're a Kopimist of the First United Church of Kopimism and you must share files on religious ground. Not a joke, it exists and it's already officially recognized as a religion in Sweden. No religious debate, of course, just a info Code: Select All http://kopimistsamfundet.us/ Wow that is wonderful